next »

[DCR]

ocspray, you can stick your snow tires up your ass. (I figured I'd get that out of the way).

My wife has an 06 CR-V, and during the sleet/ice/snow death party this morning on the way to work, she claims to have had "no issues at all".

Me?

I was all over the fucking road, getting sucked into two tracks, sliding, etc. People were in the ditch left and right, while I was mere seconds from the same fate. Every year, EVERY FUCKING YEAR, I regret when I don't have 4WD, or AWD. No brand/make/model of snow tire is going to make a substantial difference to overcome this shit.

So, mark my words:

Next winter I will have a 4WD or AWD vehicle, and the Si will be gone.

My current short list is:

CR-V
Pilot
WRX
Toyota Truck

[amadgerman]

My Jetta wasn't too bad this morning, but I had a much shorter ride into work. 

I say go for the WRX.  Those are good in both shit weather and good weather.

[ocspray]

ocspray, you can stick your snow tires up your ass. (I figured I'd get that out of the way)...No brand/make/model of snow tire is going to make a substantial difference to overcome this shit.

Geez, would you at least slather some bead lube on my hole first? I know the Michelin MXV4 all-season tires suck ass on snow. That's what came on my Accord, and there was no way I'd drive through mountain snow with them. I've yet to say this, but the time has come.

DCR, you're wrong.   Can I have that on a brass plaque?

I really wish you could drive my Si or Accord. I know I've said it before, but when I was in the Rockies last year, my 4cyl AT Accord, clad with serious, studless snow tires, outperformed a friend's 4x4 Ford Explorer with All-Season rubber. I know the conditions were worse than what you've got right now, and the car felt very stable. On snow, I have to try to break the Accord's front wheels loose, and even on ice, they still have some bite. Now that I can afford it, I'll never drive another car without dedicated winter wear.

Do you know anyone nearby that's running modern studless snow tires on a FWD car? Get behind the wheel and give it a try. The only thing better would be an AWD/4WD with snow tires. Bridgestone Blizzaks are that good. If you really want to dump your Si and be The Man of Winter, I'd suggest getting a Subaru and mounting a set of Blizzak Revo 1 tires. If that doesn't cure your winter woes, I don't know what will.

Check out TireRack's Winter Tech section before you take a stick to your Si. There's a slew of topics, and all of them are good reading for everyone driving in snow:
http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=126

Why Electronic Drivers Aids and 4WD Systems Aren't Enough
"However, it is important to remember that while the four-wheel drive vehicle's ability to accelerate in slippery conditions provides a lot of confidence, it doesn't really offer any unique advantage when the vehicle has to stop or turn. This is because the other vehicles also use all four tires to provide braking and cornering traction. Since four-wheel drive vehicles actually weigh more than their two-wheel drive counterparts, bringing them to a stop or turning a corner actually requires more traction. [emphasis mine]"

[DCR]

Ah, lest you forget...

I have had this particular issue my entire driving life. Though snow tires are an improvement, they are not a solution.

A FWD car with snow tires is no match for an AWD car or 4WD vehicle. Driving my 2006 CR-V on all-seasons yesterday was proof enough of that.

My last Si was the same way, and my hatch before that (with winter tires) was just as bad.

[ocspray]

We'll just have to disagree, and your comparison is false. You drove a 4WD with all-seasons and a FWD with all-seasons; where's the FWD with modern snow tires? 

The latest snow tires are far better than the what was available even ten years ago, and although I don't doubt your need for something safer than yesterday's Arctic Deathrace, I don't understand your resistance to the tires you've stuck up my arse. If you went to the track, you would buy tires made for that kind of driving or your car's performance would suffer greatly. The same holds true for winter driving. At best, all-season tires are a compromise, and you've proven they can't cope with your conditions. Short of an AWD on snow tires, the Si is damn near perfect for winter driving with its light weight and LSD. The only downside is it almost has too much torque. 

[DCR]

LSD helps with winter driving?

[ocspray]

Sure. Haven't you ever been driving a FWD and had some nasty torque steer from one wheel grabbing while the other spins? With LSD, you'll feel a little pull to the good side, but that's it, and the power goes where it's needed, so the iced wheel isn't completely flailing around. If you can find a place with cleared pavement on one side and ice on the other, give it a try.

[NDS]

I haven't seen any snow yet where I live, so I really can't comment on the Si's performance in it.  I must admit that my Jeep was very steady in the snow - regardless of stopping issues, the 4WD really helped keep it on track when cornering and avoiding potholes but it sucked gas enormously.

[ocspray]

My last Si was the same way, and my hatch before that (with winter tires) was just as bad.

What snow tires did you have?

[DCR]

Unfortunately, I can't remember which tires I had on a car I owned over 5 years ago. They came with the car, so I didn't even buy them.

[ocspray]

Okeydoke. I know you planned to trade your Si in after a few years anyway, but it'd be a shame for you to do it so quickly without exploring your options. So, until you do sell it, how do you plan to survive the rest of this winter? Jack Frost has just started kicking your ass, and he's got plenty left for you.

Being a hockey guy, maybe you'll appreciate this:

"For the last seven years a hockey rink has been used to provide the ultimate simulation of the icy road conditions that we'll face later in winter. By conducting acceleration, braking and cornering tests on the ice we've confirmed the differences between various winter tires and the traction advantage they have over All-Season and All-Terrain light truck tires."
http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=129&currentpage=125

[-mr. bill]

If you really want to punt a FWD for a 4WD, *you* don't want to be on performance winter, let alone your wide all-seasons.

At least give the Bridgestone Blizzak REVO 1 or Michelin X-ICE in 205/55 R16 a try.

But I'll also give you the Click and Clack advice.

WHAT WERE YOU THINKING?  WHY DID YOU GO OUT IN THAT STUFF?

Buy a FWD or 4WD, but before you put the keys in the ignition *PRETEND* you've got a RWD.  If you wouldn't go out with a RWD, you shouldn't go out with FWD or 4WD.  If you would go out in a RWD, go ahead, but still only *drive* on roads you would tackle with your RWD car.  People get in trouble tackling the steep hill because they've got 4WD.  But *all* cars have 4WB.

You hit the perfect storm of sleet, ice and snow at the perfect time (and worse, it's the first storm of the season) to make your life on the road *miserable* this week.  Don't judge a car on how it performs during the perfect storm.  (Imagine it's raining over two inches an hour and you hear someone complaining  about hydroplaning at 75MPH.)

-mr .bill

[DCR]

I went out in that stuff, because that is how it is.

Where I grew up, we only had a snow day if you couldn't force open the door to the school because of the overnight snowfall.

[ocspray]

For the most part, I think performance winter tires are the ticket in NE Kansas. If I was a Michiganderinian, I would skip performance winter tires and go straight to true studless winter tires, too. You can read the test results and see the quantitative difference in snow/ice traction, and I can definitely feel a difference.

DCR, I know that when you need to be somewhere, the weather is what it is. Last I checked, we don't live in France, and short of natural disaster grade weather, we're expected to show up.

[DCR]

Yes, this isn't France.